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Counting to 20


Okay, you blog readers.  If you are a language or older child adoption or whatever expert, I need help and advice.  When I met Tiki, he could not speak any English EXCEPT he could say "Spider Man" and he could count to twenty in ENGLISH.  Now that Tiki is totally fluent in English he can hardly make it to ten and cannot get past twelve. 

He's a smart kid.  He just learned an entirely different language in less than a year and he is learning to read.  But this counting thing is frustrating me.  I realize that I need PATIENCE!!!  I am VERY AWARE of that.  But is this normal?  Any advice (besides the patience piece)?

Comments

Unknown said…
I am not an adoption or language expert but.. My 4yr old can totally count to 20+ and knows his ABC's... yet he totally either will not say them to me correctly or won't say them at all. BUT , he does at school. Maybe he is just still a tad shy and insecure with his new language?
Julie said…
Hey, I'm Julie and I was a kamper back when it was KCO and I enjoyed following your blog, its not too often you hear about Rawandan adoptions! I'm glad to hear that it was possible for your family.
My mom runs an adoption agency and has done lots of adoptions over the years. This sounds common as kids will "play dumb" to get attention. They may seem well adjusted in every sense but they will choose one thing to "test" their parents with. One girl was about 6 when she came home and knew her colors in english but would chose one color to "play dumb" with. And it would change every week... one week she didn't know yellow, the next week it changed to blue. Very obvious that she was just playing a game. I don't know the situation with Tiki but it is possible. I wouldn't be too worried if this is the only thing he does, it will go away in time. I would be concerned if he shows other signs of attachment disorders and requires more action. But the fact that he is really smart he may just be feeling like he's not getting enough attention in his studies and is playing this game just to see if if you will help him. I wonder if he is able to count in front of other people or just you. I'm no expert, but it's one possibility worth exploring!
Kim Van Brunt said…
Hey Jamie Jo -
I'm not a language expert either, and we're still completing our first adoption... but. I just wanted to throw it out there that my little first-grader (bio daughter) has gone through many advances and setbacks in her path of learning. She is super bright and right on track... but last year, she had all her numbers and letters DOWN (written). Once she started to read, everything started reversing. For a while, she wrote almost all her numbers backward (at the beginning of 1st grade), and still gets them wrong sometimes... then her letters, most of them are good, but she'll reverse them randomly. At the same time, she's made HUGE strides with her reading ability.

I really think their little brains focus on one thing they're working really hard to learn, and the other stuff recedes a little. For Tiki, maybe he could count to 20 in English but had no idea what it meant. Now he understands numbers and is working back to that place of knowing them AND knowing what they mean. I hope that makes sense or helps in some way! Blessings to you!
Team Dragovich said…
Hi Jamie Jo... I randomly clicked on your blog from ablissfulheart and can relate to what you said... we have 5 kids, also-- 2 adopted from Ethiopia, also older children (5 & 6)-- home a year and half.

The fact that he is so fluent in English is encouraging, and leads me to think he will get back those number skills... our (english) number system between 10 and 20 makes no sense-- the "ones" number is spoken first then the "tens" number and then there is 11 and 12-- what the heck is that?? :) My son (the 7 year old) was sitting doing math with me the other day and had to pause before naming a number in the teens-- his memory jogged and he was able to say it, but told me later that he wanted to say 10-7 rather than 7-teen. Both my adopted children do have their numbers down, but... when I was teaching them to read, I taught them the letters as phonetic sounds rather than their names (something I did with all my kids), and my son, who came home knowing all the letters of the ABC's, forgot all the names of the letters for a time (many months), but he could give their phonetic sounds... and he is reading. He is just now remembering the names of the letters again.

Hope that helps! Love your neat blog :)
Shari Dragovich
Unknown said…
Learning an entirely new language in a year is wonderful, however, learning the spoken words and understanding what those words actually mean could be another thing....possibly?

Our second to the youngest of five children was born/adopted in China. She was five years old upon arriving home. We were informed by a physician it takes a good five years to not only speak a new language, but, also be able to really understand what the words you are saying mean.

We have supported Jadyn with a weekly speech therapist here in our home. Yes, she gets speech therapy at our public school as well as and English as a new language coach:-), however, what a private speech therapist has been able to do for Jadyn is invaluable...and, yes, it is costly. She has been a huge support not only for Jadyn but for our entire family as well. It is she who has kept balance and perspective for all of us. She is the one who has given us such helpful information in order to help Jadyn.

Tiki knows you are trying to help him, and, I believe just from our daughters experience he is not testing you for attention. Just think how hard it is to learn a new language....just because he could count to 20 does not mean he understood the words he was saying. It does take patience, believe me, I know, and, yet, Tiki probably understands and loves you so much for trying so hard to help him....patience is not easy when you are loving someone so much and realizing so much depends on you being the one to help him. We have also found that it has helped Jadyn after much time( she is now in second grade) it is helpful to see how much she can do on her own. It seems to help her to take some control over her own work....but, Jamie, it does take time....and patience:-).....and time:-)
Jamie Jo! Just read your blog on my phone at school and it got me so excited bc this is what I do all day!! I'm a math intervention specialist (sounds way cooler than it is) but I teach a program called Math Recovery and it intervention for students in 1st grade who are low in math and I basically work with sweet kiddos right at where it sounds like Tiki is in math. I'll send you some ideas when I get home to my computer and it's easier to type. You could look at the mathrecovery.org website and there might be some ideas there too. And yes, he will definitely get it!!! But it does take time and major patience. Learning to count/add and understanding math is a true developmental process for these little guys... So I am a huge believer of just keeping quiet as much as possible (when it's our first instinct to jump in and tell them why it was wrong or how to get the right answer) and to let their little minds learn it and grasp it and understand it through practicing it as much as possible. Send you some games and things when I get home this afternoon. Wish i could come work with home everyday!!!! :) Love you!!
Rob and Alison said…
Love your Blog!

Bio-children or adopted children? I think you are over thinking this and worrying to much. Kids do this all the time, especially from ages 3-12. I'm not sure about doing this on purpose, I've never like that answer. As children develop their weaknesses and strengths begin to show themselves. Hormones, stress or lack of interest, wanting to do something else, can play into academic achievement.

Might sound a little silly but does he like to singing or dance? Making a silly song out of the numbers and singing and dancing up and down the stairs of your house it is always fun and some of the other kids could join in. Or make a dance using numbers. If he loves sports, integrate it into throwing snow balls, basketball, draw numbers in the snow, etc… Count pennies, if he gets the numbers right he can keep them, that’s a great test of knowledge, kids love $$. You have to stay relaxed about it or he will sense your anxiety and feel less willing to try.

I bet after a week or so of doing this he will be back on track.

Usually putting numbers in a different setting, than an academic one will help him to learn or break the brain freeze if he is experiencing one. Either way you and he will have a little fun figuring it out!

The math recovery program sounds great too.

Adopting from Rwanda!
Courtney said…
I am completely unqualified to speak on this, but wanted to say that our pediatrician told me when my kids were all about 18 months old NOT to teach them the alphabet because then it would confuse them later on because it would have only been from MEMORY of a song and not the actual letters and order they go in. I don't truly understand it all or how but seeing your post made that come back to me and I can sort of wrap my head around what she might have been referring to with what you state with TIKI. I think that they taught him that so he'd have a head start in the english language, and for his good, but didn't really TEACH the numbers, just the sounds they make.

Who knows. It could be nothing...but just my 2 cents...and you typically get what you paid for. :)
call me crazy, but i would decide not to worry about it at all. those numbers were abstract before and now they are real. he's smart enough to get that he didn't 'get' it before. he'll be at 100 when it all clicks in! remind me to tell u about della.
Sarah W. said…
Everyone seems to know way more than me, but my son is almost 5. He can count to 100....except the teens. So it seems really normal to me. So even if he did know them, the teens are hard and make no sense!!

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